Speaker 2: Welcome. this podcast.

Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to the next episode of the Water Polo Expert Talk Podcast. Today I welcome again Tony Azevedo in my podcast and we talked about his view on the final eight this year and all about this virtual reality stuff he's doing at the 6-8th Water Polo Academy in the US today. So I hope you enjoyed the talk as well as we did and let's turn in. Yeah, so let's go. Dive into the topics. So how are you? So where are How is the academy going? It's great, you know, we are full for summer, so we have kids coming from all over. We actually have seven states represented. We have a Hungarian, a Spaniard who's here, and we just finished our last showcase, which was super exciting because we introduced... I saw it in Utah or where was it? Yes, in St. George, Utah. And what we did was we do as we always do, split the kids up evenly based on their rankings. We came up with a fantasy league and we had a draft and all the kids were playing and we saw their value through our analytics and stats. And it was really exciting. All the college coaches asked and we had like six kids signed with schools.

Speaker 1: Cool. I really get the feedback from Mitsu based on his experiences with people calling him all across the US at the moment. Somebody from Hawaii is flying in somewhere. It's really a booster at the moment. Basically, the key or the initial idea was really to... to have a next episode on the podcast or a short discussion at least about all the, let's say, new technology stuff you're using at the moment. So the VR stuff and so on. So this was the one I said, okay, maybe we have to talk again. So this is really exciting because I think you are the first one using this one in this water polo area, right? That's right. So essentially with the VR, if you think about it, it's just natural in our sport and why places in Europe are more advanced than elsewhere is because the more you see water polo, the smarter you are, the easier it comes to you. Right. Every day a player here plays basketball and watches the NBA on, you know, three games. So by the time they're 18 years old, they know mostly everything about basketball and then you fix some fundamentals and stuff. In water pool, we don't have that. And so what if you're a kid who started three years, you've only been playing for two years. How are you gonna catch up to the kids who've been playing for eight years, right? And physically, it's not possible to catch up and play that many games and put yourself in that scenario. So what we've created, in the VR and what they're finding with NFL quarterbacks, what they're finding with baseball players and golfers even is when you put on those goggles, it puts you in those scenarios and you go over and over and within a span of 10 minutes, you can teach yourself exactly where you should have been looking, where you should have moved, what should have happened like you spent three hours of training, right?

Speaker 1: Yes. And this means that you also cooperate with people from other sports. Yes. So you mentioned the NFL of quarterback players and so on. based on their experience in their area of sports. there's a real communication cooperation between the sports than this case for the water polo stuff. That's right. Well, it's not just the sports, it's also the medical world. So one of the biggest ways they've gone in is like teaching doctors how to, how to do certain surgeries or certain, um, you know, whatever certain things, uh, first in VR before, so that instead of training for, you know, months at a time, they can sit there and do everything and see it all firsthand. And I've had kids here and it's funny because a lot of the kids we get are outside of California. So their water polo IQ is not the highest, you know? They came from Oregon or they came from the polo. So some of these simple things is tough for them. But once I get them in the VR and I ask them, oh, I said, be honest with me, like same in the water. If you don't think you're getting out, like, let's talk about it. If you don't like it, like, don't do it. I want to know. Every single one finishes and goes, that was amazing. I learned so much. I can't believe I was there. And then they watch themselves now. We can also film them. and they go, my God, I terrible. And I'm like, I've been telling you that the whole time. Now you get to see how terrible you look. Yeah, so it's a beneficial situation for both parties in this case, for you as a coach and also for player saying, okay, maybe the coach is right and I have to go left way and not right way.

Speaker 2: Right. That's right. And it is something fun. I think in our sport, we have to think forward, right? These kids, they're, getting more technologically savvy. They're, they're on iPad all day. They're on phones. They're on V. They're using VR on their own. Well, why don't we adapt? And why don't we create, you know, a VR waterfall program, which we, which we've created? Why don't we create more analytics so that these kids can start tracking their stats and using numbers to help them get to the next level because you know what water polo in the 80s is not water polo in 2021 and it's not going to be in the next 10 years. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, and this sounds like that you're really developed this for your academy then from the very beginning and very start. Yeah. So maybe you can tell us a little bit about the process of developing the VR environment. Yeah, so basically there's two ways, right, that we work with the VR. One at our academy, which is kind of a specialized version where we film our athletes doing six on five front court, whatever. have a VR camera on the head of the athletes and in behind the goal. And then we go and walk through what was happening and ask them, you know, why did you do that? Okay, so this is very interesting because you're saying, okay, you have a camera on the head of each player. And then you do the, let's say in my words, the recording of all these stuff. And after that, you do the analysis maybe. So this is nothing so, let's say not so much different as in the past or today with the normal recording and videos and so on and so forth. But you have all the other aspects

Speaker 1: about your environment and all the senses of each player in this game. That's right. So the goal is, that instead of having to film a game and have a player watch the game and then you talk it through, now the player A is in their own. mean, sometimes we just have a camera behind the player. Now the player is in the game. It's more like, you know, and then I already talking through the scenarios. So a player can take this video home. and go over all of these scenarios 100 times on their own instead of having a coach every day. Now we do the coach aspect because that's something special at the academy. So I walk them through it, ask them questions. But the big goal right now, our kids around the world who have purchased this, they buy it and they go through six on five. Maggie and I are talking about what they should be looking at. How are they? Why are they moving? Look here, look here. And now without a coach, you know, could be in the middle of Minnesota or middle of somewhere, no water polo, and you are getting smarter and smarter and smarter every day. Okay, yes, in this case, I have to think about a subscription for this case, maybe for myself. To be a little bit smarter and to have the own experience with the VR goggles then. Okay, so what about the pricing or the cost for these? So you mentioned that you have also kids and players all around the world or not only coming from the US maybe at the moment?

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 1: So how is it going? they're connecting, connect you or contact you over the website or app or whatever, and then you send what? A subscription, they have to buy the goggles for themselves and how is this working? there's two ways we're doing it, right? One way is the most common way is you purchase from us the goggles and all the information uploaded already so that the moment it arrives at your house, it goes and you have everything. Now those goggles you can use for all the other games and whatnot, but all those packages are purchased. It's already in there. The second part, is if you already have some of those goggles, there is a way for us to send it and download it to you. It's a little more complicated, but we have done it. And the third part, which will come out very soon, is we'll be our own store. So if you buy those goggles on your own, you just go to the store. That is where we're working towards. We're just not there yet. Okay, yeah. So in this case, in the second scenario, you mentioned that you have to put this software or the firmware or whatever from you on the goggles from the customer, which is already existing in this case. That's right. And now, what we want to do with that is really control the user experience, right? Because what's happened is a lot of people, we send them kind of like a USB to download it, blah, blah, or tell them how to do it. it ends up not working and they get frustrated. And that sucks because that's not, that's not our goal. But then you turn it around and you get, now if it all shows up and it's all there,

Speaker 2: Now they're very happy because it's very easy and they get to use it again. It doesn't exist. It's really exciting for us. especially in the case that it's not available at the moment, you mentioned, when you are your own supplier and you have your own shop and can purchase this on your own, then you are really independent. This is really great also for the customer, you mentioned, for the kids and players around the world. It's very easy to buy it as a bundle, not each piece separately. No, how to- Cool, yeah, think this would be, as you mentioned, because all the young kids are really working and living with all these kinds of stuff. And when we are not really adapt our sports to this one, it's not really easy then in the future. No, I think, you know, we on right now, the Miami dolphins just signed a contract to use it. And it's really interesting how football is using it. And it's changed, changed our, my perspective a little bit. I like the perspective of going through, scenarios and talking it out, but football is also using it in a very basic model to teach athletes, Hey, this is the positions of football. This is the basic movements. And I really liked that. And I think we're going to start to do that as well, because

Speaker 2: I want kids as young as eight, right, 10, to be able to put them on and say, this is a center position. This is a goalie. Watch them, look what it's like. And then slowly as they progress, right, we always use crawl, first walk, run, sprint. They can eventually push themselves on the VR to be as knowledgeable as maybe some of the older athletes. And that'd be really exciting. Yes, in this case, they come to you or to any club, let's say, a minimum level of water polo skills. So, you are able to teach the basics via the VR stuff and so on. And you have then after that only working on the specifics and enhancements of these basic skills. That's right. And something else that's interesting that the Miami Dolphins do is every football program, just like every waterfall program, they have their own style, right? So when you come play for Stanford, there's a style and there's plays at Stanford. If you go play for UCLA, there's styles and plays. So what we're telling all these colleges as well, it'd be so valuable if the recruits, before you show up to the first day of practice, you've had a month of all of their plays. So now you know everything. So a coach doesn't have to waste a month, you, hey, we don't do that. This is play B, this is play C, whatever it is. Yeah, so you are able to, let's say, provide the playbook in upfront. So before the season or the practice is starting, then it is really, really interesting that you mentioned the connection between football and water polo beer, because I think we can really benefit from other sports which are, let's say, more popular.

Speaker 2: That's right.

Speaker 1: maybe not in the US, but also in Germany. So we can benefit from football or soccer in this case here in Europe. So I'm pretty sure that they will use some kind of stuff also in the future. Yeah, no, think and that's just been it, Andreas. The VR was a Stanford connection I had and we started talking and a lot of people, it's so hard, they don't have clients and I think from my point of view, it's always been, well, that's what I've taken my role as is what do I do to help the sport? Whatever it is, we take a team from Croatia and they said, you can't take women's team because there's no women's water polo in And I said, well, let's start it. And so we're going to, we're going to start helping and we're already have some teams coming out. We're going to have coaching series. Maggie's going to do some things out there and Mark my words. And hopefully in, you know, 10 years, there's a women's program and Maggie's playing for it and you, right. And then the fun thing really has been the big push on our game desk, right? I know a lot of, a lot of companies have really tried to come in the water polo and make, make the stats all digital. which is great. And I think everyone's doing that right. But what's really, feel separated us is that is that connection to the individual athlete. No one, everyone's about the club, the tournament. We're about the athlete, right? And that's what's so exciting is I finished a game in Utah and I have, you know, 20 athletes running after the game to their phone so they could see all their stats and their plus or minus and understand where their value is. Then after a tournament, when an athlete comes to me and says, hey, I feel like I didn't do that well. Well, we can look at their last five games and go over and say, well, look, look how many turnovers you had during the weekend or look at how many objections. These are little things that we can fix and help them be better instead of you finish. And right now you finish a game. It's just, it's dependent on who you talk to. If you're lucky enough to have have Shtam as your coach, then he's going to know what to say.

Speaker 2: If you don't have him and there's someone else, then maybe it's not going to be the right answer, right? So we were trying to. Yeah, so at the moment I would absolutely agree with you that it's more or less only a feeling or an impression from somebody about your game and your aesthetics in this game. And when you have really the figures in front of you, it's something different. Yes. Okay. Yes. You already prepare for outside, Already I know no, it's all right No problem. So maybe one last question before you have to leave to go through the practice. What do you think about the final eight? So I saw you're really following the games with your your athletes. Yes, first off, it's amazing. I think Europeans, they have a lot more accessibility to these games. But now with the live streaming, it's unacceptable that so many Americans and Brazilians and Australians didn't watch those games, right? If you ever aspired to great, then you would watch those games. And if you didn't, then I don't want you coming to me telling me that you think you should be great. So that's first. for me, what I thought of the Final Four,

Speaker 2: or the fight, final eight, you know, I thought, look, I think lens done a good job. It's exciting to watch that, you know, the, the lights and, and, and, you know, the, the, the excitement around it, the live stream was good. I do, you know, I thought, I thought the level didn't seem as high to me this, this, this around, and I don't know if it was COVID and, players ability. just seemed, you know, to me, I've watched every final four or final eight. I was at the one in Italy two years ago. I watched the one obviously last year. The rest of time I've been participating in them. I just felt there was something missing on the quality this year. And again, maybe the players were too tired. Maybe it's too many games for them. Maybe it's too close to Tokyo or the whole Tokyo delay kind of a factor. But that would be my two cents, right? I'm proud of Ben Halleck. He became the first American ever to win a final four. At the same time, I didn't think it was, it's gonna go down as one of the best final fours ever. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So I think I have quite the same impression about the final, or at least about the whole tournament, the final eight tournament. That's, but I guess I would say this is based on the situation before the tournament, before the final eight, all the weeks and months before regarding COVID and so on. So I think that is really the reason for, for maybe that it's not on the highest level this year. And then the last thing I'll say, and then I do have to go is, is, know, I just, I I'm disappointed that it's in Serbia. I just don't understand that. Right. Like I don't understand. If we're trying to grow the sport, we keep, keep these tournaments in the, the areas where the sports, the biggest and strongest, right? Now, if you always, every other year you want to go back to a Serbia and Italy, a Spain do it. But why, why explain to me why.

Speaker 2: that the fastest growing European it seems like one of the fastest growing European leagues that wasn't even around really when I played was France why is France not hosting and that's a push right now they should do whatever we can to get them to host right I know Germany would Yes, it was original in Hannover, to be honest, but we are not able to host it. Wasp was not able to host it due to the medical staff and COVID staff and security checks, COVID checks and so on and so on. so I think this is maybe then the reason for this year. But next year, I would absolutely agree with you. But this year, think Belgrade was the safest one. And let me ask you, we're really all around all for the better of the sport. And we think that if all the countries, you know, playing is at a higher level is going to help the sport, which we all know it is. Why wouldn't there be a a final eight in the U S why wouldn't there be a final eight in Asia? And I don't want to hear like a money situation because we know the money that they get. That's their job is to market and to get enough money to say, Hey clubs, instead of paying to go here, we're going to figure out. I guarantee I can find a help, find a sponsor in New York that's going to host these guys or Miami have a wonderful tournament in the U S and then all of a sudden people know who these athletes are because I go to my athletes to again, our top level athletes. And I say, do you know who Prokofiev is from Russia? Do you know who? who you know, Valanki from Hungary is and they have no idea. They have no idea and that's a little bit their fault but it's a lot more our fault because we don't give these athletes the exposure they need.

Speaker 2: I agree.

Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, look text me any time or email me. I can find like this time always on Wednesdays is the best. It was just today I have this thing at 12 30. So see ya.

Speaker 2: Do nothing